41 Replies Latest reply: Mar 18, 2014 5:01 AM by Joon Brown RSS

    Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?

    Ted Hopton

      I'm interested in hearing from anyone who has both Jive and Salesforce.com's Chatter deployed for their employees. How well do they co-exist? What do people use each for, and how well do people understand what to use each for? Have you done any custom integration between Jive and Salesforce.com?

       

      To be explicit, the scenario I am exploring is where both Chatter and Jive are available to employees, and how that works in practice.

        • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
          Frank Gebhardt

          Ted,

           

          interesting that you raise that question. For us, it's more can Chatter and Google Chat co-exist.

           

          I believe Jive has a slightly different tune to chatter. Chatter is more immediate and it is not a repository of past discussions. There is no search. It's more like Twitter. Jive on the other hand is a searchable repository, it's using structural components and it supports time lags.

           

          For example, I can write an article or discussion in Jive and to get the attention of our Sales staff I post the subject and the link into the chatter stream. Sometimes I get replies within chatter - mostly people use Jive and add their knowledge / opinion directly.

           

          F.

            • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
              Jim Buck

              Frank,

               

              So, do your sales teams primarily use Chatter to communicate and collaborate with one another, or are they using Jive?  I'm still not sure I understand why an organization would want to use both.  It seems to me that having both could simply segregate and silo the sales org form the rest of the organization unless it is specifically engaged in a topic.

               

              Jim

                • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                  Frank Gebhardt

                  Jim,

                   

                  you are correct some information gets duplicated. Although that's mainly due to the respective audience.

                   

                  The Sales people "live" in Salesforce. That's their main tool next to email. Jive is a resource to exchange information with the engineering and marketing team as well as to provide the rest of the organisation with some information about certain customer projects.

                   

                  The rest of the organisation doesn't use chatter. They "live" in their respective environment (CAD, ERP, Develeopment, ..) to achieve their objectives. They use Jive to collaborate, exchange ideas, inform others and ask for feedback or help.

                   

                  Jive forms the "glue" binding the different ways together.

                   

                  cheers

                  Frank

              • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                Ted Hopton

                Frank, I raise the question because Salesforce positions itself as the technology to create a social business. Chatter is presented as comparable to Jive, not just an internal Twitter stream.

                 

                Jim, I'm not sure why an organization would want to use both, either -- hence my question. Looking for anyone with experience successfully using both.

                • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                  Sean Rivers

                  We have Chatter as well and have a very very hard time getting employees to use it for anything meaningful. Google Talk is way to embedded in our culture. We IM someone just see if they are available to take a call, we IM people to see if they are going to make a meeting when in doubt we IM. We have tried to use Chatter as a kind of Group Chat, since Google does not do that, but it does not alert like Google Talk and often gets ignored.

                  • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                    Janine

                    Great question... we have just deployed Salesforce.com a month ago to our US sales team and they love Chatter.  We are also in the middle of deploying Jive to the global P&L including that team.

                     

                    While we don't have much experience yet I'd agree with Frank's coments above.  The feedback we received from the sales team so far has been "tell us what we need to do where now... if we can do the same in Jive let's just turn that funciton off in Salesforce.com."  We'll evaluate that option in another couple of months after they get a better feel for jive, too.

                     

                    In general...Chatter is very limited in terms of collaboration across an org.  And in our case cannot be used by more than just the Sales team.  We are planning to connect the two maybe later this year or early next.

                      • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                        Ted Hopton

                        Thanks, Janine. You raised a good point: what if Chatter is only or primarily used by the sales teams while Jive is available to all employees? Does that make it even harder to engage the sales teams in your Jive community? Or does it awaken them to the power of social business and lead them to try Jive, too? (Yeah, I don't really think the latter will happen!)

                      • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                        dshimberg

                        The question is the same one that I have been asking for months.  At BMC, we are in a unique position with both Chatter and Jive.  Our use cases for Jive are (right or wrong) distinctly different for Chatter.  Jive is the external facing "community" engine, while Chatter is the internal sales, marketing and product lead communication engine.  Since we were an early adopter of Jive, my theory is we did not expand the use cases as the product matured.  There is minimal integration currently in place between the two environments.

                        • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                          Cyndi Zaino

                          Jive and Chatter can absolutely co-exist - how you approach the implementation comes down to several factors: what your users need, how they work and exchange information with each other,  and what tools they currently use to work together; as well as what your requirements are around things like visibility and access to information, security, control and flexibility of the platform, and integration to existing systems and tools.

                           

                          I've seen Chatter used successfully when it's tightly integrated into the existing CRM data - it's great at supporting activities like swarming around deals to help make the sale, updating account teams on particular events (wins, challenges, risks, opportunities, etc with the account), or providing more context/documentation on particular products that your team works with.  I find Jive very useful for collaborative and team-based interactions, as well as managing corporate knowledge and information - working across departments to support ideation/creation of a new product or service, managing communications and deliverables for a project, or housing, organizing, and collaborating on all sorts of collateral and assets for the organization (sales decks, marketing campaigns, templates, etc).

                           

                          Jive is also much more feature-rich than Chatter since it's been around much longer than Chatter has - I've seen several projects where it was important to have a lot of control over visibility, permissions and access to data was important and Jive was able to accommodate those requirements.  In other projects, simplicity was important - they had only a few use cases and didn't want to over-complicate the approach - and additionally they needed it to tie into their existing CRM, so Chatter was their choice.

                           

                          The good thing is that both platforms are rather open and have great eco-systems of 3rd party developers and apps to make integration and customization relatively easy.

                           

                          Hope this (long) answer helps - good luck!

                          • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                            Richard Rashty

                            I think you can have them co-exist, but only if you integrate the collaboration at both the account and opportunity levels to ensure all participants within the CRM process are involved.  Chatter works well for the sales and marketing folks, but the social collaboration needs of the other stakeholders make chatter a much weaker platform.  Chatter as part of the full SFDC license can be expensive.  The integration of JIVE and SFDC incurs additional cost and effort, so SFDC would tell you not to bother and just purchase Chatter licenses for everyone in the enterprise.

                             

                            I personally have extensive experience within social collaboration on both platforms, and while JIVE is more capable to engage with employees across the entire enterprise, Chatter is very simple to use, as its feature functionality need not be so expansive for the type of social collaboration necessary in the sales cycle.

                             

                            I have seen deep integration of the 2 platforms, and the use-case functionality is fantastic if the integration is done properly, and the usage is clearly articulated to the users.

                              • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                                Tracy Maurer

                                Great to hear, Richard. I foresee further discussions with you, me and Ted on this topic in the future. 

                                • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                                  Kim Nelson

                                  Great thread!  I too have been asking this same question.  We are rolling out Salesforce and Chatter at our Sales Kickoff in October and we are working to determine what are best practices for using Jive, Salesforce and Chatter to make sure we are clear in our communication of the usage for each.  Our issue is that our sales team has been the slowest adopter of Jive, and mostly using it for document repository, information gathering and one-directional communication of policy, procedures, etc.  They have not fully utilized the collaborative functionality of Jive, I think in anticipation of the rollout of salesforce.  We want to be clear at the time of rollout, what are the best practices for each.  We also saw a demo of the Appirio app and I was curious if anyone has tested that out in their community or engaged professional services to help with integration between the two platforms.

                                   

                                  Richard Rashty wrote:

                                   

                                  I have seen deep integration of the 2 platforms, and the use-case functionality is fantastic if the integration is done properly, and the usage is clearly articulated to the users.

                                  Do you happen to have any examples of clearly articulated usage between the two?

                                • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                                  Ted Hopton

                                  Related to this thread, I will attend Dreamforce this September in SF so I can learn more about Chatter. Any other Jive customers going to be there?

                                  • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                                    Gino Rossi

                                    I love everything I've read here.  Keep them coming.

                                    I might be looking at a Chatter/Jive situation as well very soon.

                                     

                                    Gino

                                    • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                                      rob_narejko

                                      Hi Ted,

                                       

                                      I am late to this post and would be curious as to what you decided and why.

                                       

                                      From what I have read from the Gartner 2011 Social software in the workplace doc (download is here, click on hyper link in middle of the page)

                                      - "no track record yet of Chatter for structured tasks, ongoing projects or formal communities" (p 26)

                                        - so if that is what you are trying to do, I would look else where

                                      - pricing is high for Chatter (well, free to $15/seat/month depending on version)

                                      - and if you do want to integrate Chatter with Jive, my understanding is that is an additional monthly fee as well

                                        - additional fees apply to integrating MS OCS, Lync & IBM SameTime

                                       

                                      You can get Spark OpenFire for free and all the products (Chatter, OCS, Lync, ST, Spark) have similar functionality

                                      - it is a Jive lead open source product / platform so it must be integrated well! 

                                        • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                                          Tracy Maurer

                                          Hi Rob,

                                           

                                          Not so much a decision as grappling with how to move forward. We have several divisions who already use Salesforce.com, and with it comes the Chatter licenses. The sales folks love it, and we're trying to understand better how to advise/corral them so that conversations don't get fragmented, as well as to educate people about how to use the right tool for the job. We don't have one central IT group, so we have to meet people where they are and help guide them to intelligent solutions. We're looking for tools to help us meet them where they are now, and also to help integrate where possible to give them an easier-to-understand future.

                                           

                                          Thanks for your feedback!

                                            • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                                              rob_narejko

                                              Hi Tracey,

                                               

                                              Would an educational grid help guide your users?

                                              ie you would have headers of Feature /Function, Chatter, Jive along the top.

                                              - on the left hand side, under Feature/Function you would have the feature/function listed

                                                  - you may want to add a clear definition to explain the value of the feature to their roles and the value added to the client & company knowledge base

                                              - in the same row as the feature, under Chatter or Jive, put an 'X' or 'check' in the box

                                                  - your organization needs to know what it wants to accomplish with each

                                                  - if there is a check in the column, add a few words about how Chatter or Jive enables the individual and company goals

                                                  - if there is an X in the column, explain what they and the company are losing if they continue to use that software for that feature

                                               

                                              You would not need to list all features, just the ones where there is potential overlap, gaps, misuse (according to what is in the best interest of the company) or which platform you definitely want to use for certain features. Will this catch everything? Probably not, but at least there is a stated direction.

                                               

                                              A summary (rule of thumb) should be developed once you have the above grid completed to guide people to the proper tool.

                                              As you know, it is easier to remember summaries than all the fine details for most people.

                                               

                                              I hope that helps!

                                                • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                                                  Tracy Maurer

                                                  So then do you and others on this thread have suggestions for use cases for Salesforce? One of the hard things for me is that I haven't been in sales since long before SFDC came into play, and so I don't really have the context at this point. I can see how it IS being used, but it would help to get some suggestions as to the "best" ways to use it when you also have a Jive instance used by the company at large. I can of course make some educated guesses, but would love to have some validation from others.

                                                    • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                                                      rob_narejko

                                                      Don't under estimate your insight. Your knowledge of your company's objectives and what benefits the tools are providing are guideposts. If the two are aligned, you are good. Going forward, your educated guesses can become a trial for a select few.

                                                       

                                                      The search for 'best' follows the 80/20 rule (or even 90 / 10). I understand your pursuit of 'best' - not knocking it - but sometimes the reward isn't worth the effort.

                                                       

                                                      Unfortunately I can't help you with Salesforce / Chatter use cases as we don't use either of them.

                                                      Can your contacts at Salesforce help out? They most likely won't have the Jive expertise, but you know your company's objectives and can sift the wheat from the chaff.

                                                       

                                                      You probably have some very clever people using SalesForce / Chatter, so gather info from them. Start a Jive 'place' for Chatter and encourage the Chatter gurus to contribute their 'best practices' and just in general, how they are using it. You can then see what they are doing and see if it aligns with corporate objectives. (You stated you already knew this, but you may be surprised at what some people are doing..)

                                                       

                                                      Looking forward to what other have to say...

                                                      • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                                                        Aaron Kim

                                                        Have you considered using Jive Anywhere? It comes with a few cartridges built for SalesForce.com. It's not an apples-to-apples competitor to Chatter, but it does have some interesting advantages, such as the ability to persist content on the Jive side, meaning that, if the organization moves away from SalesForce as their CRM, the content will still be there.

                                                          • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                                                            Tracy Maurer

                                                            We are trying to do this, but there are errors that Jive is trying to work through for our specific set-up. But the real issue is that we aren't in a position to dictate what people do use. What we can do is provide guidance as to best practices. I do think having Jive Anywhere in place will help, but I don't think it will stop usage of Chatter. The combination of Jive 6 and Jive Anywhere will get us closer to that (since you can have multiple streams). As it is in Jive 5, we don't have the ability to carve off steams of information specific to departments or divisions. Chatter does give them that ability if only because they are on separate instances of Chatter.

                                                  • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                                                    Kevin Joyce

                                                    It's now been more than 16-mos since this discussion started & ~8-mos since the last comment was posted.  So, has there been any new insights gained based on experience/research that can expose addl details regarding this topic.

                                                     

                                                    The comments thus far have been really relevant & invaluable in an exercise I am doing internally.  However, I'd like to have some more recent thoughts or affirmation on the previous thoughts in this thread.

                                                    • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                                                      Kevin Joyce

                                                      Ted et al, does anyone know of a Public Chatter community in which this topic is being discussed?  If so, please share links/details. Do you know someone who's lived in Sfdc/Chatter & are now ramping up on a Jive instance?  I'd like to garner their perspective as well.

                                                        • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                                                          Ted Hopton

                                                          I don't know of a community where this is being discussed, Kevin. That's why I asked my question here a year ago. I even went to Dreamforce last year hoping to meet other Jive & Salesforce customers to learn what they were doing, but I only found one or two, and in neither case did they have situations that were relevant.

                                                           

                                                          I'd suggest asking your Jive sales rep for other customers they know of dealing with this.

                                                        • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                                                          Ted Hopton

                                                          I'm still looking for answers and to learn from other Jive customers who have also deployed Chatter, so I started a group where we can share experiences and ideas: Chatter and Salesforce.com and Jive. If you're interested, go there and ask to join and I'm happy to let you in.

                                                          • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                                                            Joon Brown

                                                            Jive 7 and JiveX seems to addressed this need.

                                                             

                                                            In our org, we use both and so far they have been totally separate.  I am experimenting the integration and ran into a problem but once it is fixed, I will post the result.

                                                             

                                                            Here is their write up Deal Room.

                                                             

                                                            Jive 7

                                                            http://docs.jivesoftware.com/jive/7.0/community_admin/index.jsp?topic=/com.jivesoftware.help.sbs.online/admin/DealRoomBestPractices.html

                                                             

                                                            JiveX

                                                            http://docs.jivesoftware.com/jivecloud/community_user/index.jsp?topic=/com.jivesoftware.help.sbs.online/user/JiveDealRoom.html

                                                             

                                                            Interesting use case is that SFDC (Salesforce) user choose to create a group to discuss in Jive for a specific opportunity in SFDC.  Conceptually, this could create large number of groups in Jive.  Chatter feeds and Jive discussion suppose to go bi-directional as should. 

                                                            This integration is far better than prior integration features in Jive 5 and 6.

                                                              • Re: Can Chatter and Jive Co-Exist?
                                                                Joon Brown

                                                                OK.  This is a follow up on PoC of integrating JiveX (Cloud version) and SFDC (Sandboxes).

                                                                 

                                                                Here are some major findings.

                                                                1. If you get a "Trial" or "Marketing" version of JiveX, be sure to get an instance of full version with StreamOnce enabled.

                                                                2. Underlying component that integrates two environment is StreamOnce and Chatter.  So if you did not enabled Chatter, it will not work.

                                                                3. One instance of JiveX can connect to multiple instances of SFDC which is good for companies with multiple SFDC Orgs.

                                                                4. Unfortunately SFDC instance can only connect to one Jive.  If you have multiple Jive instances, you got a problem.  I think the design in SFDC app for Jive has intention of supporting multiple connections but it is not built that way yet.  (Or I couldn't make it work)

                                                                5. Out of box integration of Deal room will give you Chatter feed and limited data pulled from SFDC Opportunity and account associated with into a Jive Place (Group) that the SFDC user create.

                                                                6. Setting up a connection between them are fairly straight forward.  (Be sure to pay attention to Deal Room Settings) - Special Thanks to Ryan Raynis

                                                                7. If you need more deeper integration, you need Jive development and possibly SFDC development too.

                                                                 

                                                                So, I got a question to this branch of discussion.

                                                                We have high number of opportunities hence will create large number Deal Room (places).  How do we manage them?

                                                                 

                                                                Here is what would look like in Jive.

                                                                Jive Deal Room.png

                                                                And, this is how it looks in SFDC.

                                                                SFDC Jive Deal Room view.png